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 Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!

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Ghost_Star
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Fri Mar 15, 2013 11:33 am

masta518 wrote:


Yeah, 4-5TE for max 4*. Really low Sad

it is what it is
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masta518
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Fri Mar 15, 2013 11:36 am

Ghost_Star wrote:
masta518 wrote:


Yeah, 4-5TE for max 4*. Really low Sad

it is what it is
Yeah, and it's getting hard to sell even at that price too. Fresh4* are migrating to luna transactions as well. Everything is turned upside down! Basketball
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Ghost_Star
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Fri Mar 15, 2013 11:43 am

masta518 wrote:
Ghost_Star wrote:
masta518 wrote:


Yeah, 4-5TE for max 4*. Really low Sad

it is what it is
Yeah, and it's getting hard to sell even at that price too. Fresh4* are migrating to luna transactions as well. Everything is turned upside down! Basketball


fresh 4*'s have been buyable for luna since day one. 2-5te for a maxed 4* is more than reasonable imo.
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masta518
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Fri Mar 15, 2013 12:01 pm

Ghost_Star wrote:
masta518 wrote:
Ghost_Star wrote:
masta518 wrote:


Yeah, 4-5TE for max 4*. Really low Sad

it is what it is
Yeah, and it's getting hard to sell even at that price too. Fresh4* are migrating to luna transactions as well. Everything is turned upside down! Basketball


fresh 4*'s have been buyable for luna since day one. 2-5te for a maxed 4* is more than reasonable imo.

When I started playing, it was very difficult to find someone selling fresh common 4* for luna. I also don't think that back in September, 4* were worth less than 1 TE.
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Fuhajin



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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Fri Mar 15, 2013 12:07 pm

Ghost_Star wrote:
you can earn te/pots in events

For the 2 last events, Pots and TE you could earn were non-tradeable.


Ghost_Star wrote:
tl;dr: learn to play

I'm new to this game, I already know that, but thanks anyway
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Ghost_Star
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Fri Mar 15, 2013 12:12 pm

masta518 wrote:
Ghost_Star wrote:
masta518 wrote:
Ghost_Star wrote:
masta518 wrote:


Yeah, 4-5TE for max 4*. Really low Sad

it is what it is
Yeah, and it's getting hard to sell even at that price too. Fresh4* are migrating to luna transactions as well. Everything is turned upside down! Basketball


fresh 4*'s have been buyable for luna since day one. 2-5te for a maxed 4* is more than reasonable imo.

When I started playing, it was very difficult to find someone selling fresh common 4* for luna. I also don't think that back in September, 4* were worth less than 1 TE.

well back in the day, fresh 4*'s were 2-5te each, but you could also buy them for 200-500k luna. the te price has dropped but the luna price is about the same. i dont remember ever having an issue buying 4*'s for luna, i got the full set of dream breaker and princes 4*'s for luna during their respective events.
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masta518
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Fri Mar 15, 2013 2:26 pm

Ghost_Star wrote:
masta518 wrote:
Ghost_Star wrote:
masta518 wrote:
Ghost_Star wrote:
masta518 wrote:


Yeah, 4-5TE for max 4*. Really low Sad

it is what it is
Yeah, and it's getting hard to sell even at that price too. Fresh4* are migrating to luna transactions as well. Everything is turned upside down! Basketball


fresh 4*'s have been buyable for luna since day one. 2-5te for a maxed 4* is more than reasonable imo.

When I started playing, it was very difficult to find someone selling fresh common 4* for luna. I also don't think that back in September, 4* were worth less than 1 TE.

well back in the day, fresh 4*'s were 2-5te each, but you could also buy them for 200-500k luna. the te price has dropped but the luna price is about the same. i dont remember ever having an issue buying 4*'s for luna, i got the full set of dream breaker and princes 4*'s for luna during their respective events.

Interesting. Ever since I joined, I've found it difficult to get people to sell 4* for luna even after spamming wall posts :p
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Tattycoram
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Fri Mar 15, 2013 3:35 pm

I sell 4s for luna to new players. But that aside, again I think in some ways people are seeing a problem where there isn't one regarding the increase in value of TE. People say the market is collapsing / "card prices are dropping" etc but another way to look at it is that TE value is increasing.

TE value increasing might be a problem for someone collecting TE to use in events, but for most people (such as those posting in this thread) we seem interested in TE mainly for it's value as a card trading currency. You used to have to pay 30TE or more for a 5* card. Now you can pay about 15te for the same 5* card. Similarly, 6*s and max 4*s have dropped in price too. TE is becoming more valuable for ALL cards. CARDS STILL HOLD THE SAME RELATIVE VALUE TO EACH OTHER.

So what if I sell a card today for 15TE that I paid 30TE for a month ago? If the only point of the sell is to collect TE to buy another card (using TE to facilitate trading, basically) I can buy MORE with my 15TE today than I could have a month ago, so - assuming I bought at fair market value of the moment and I'm selling at fair market value of the moment - I'm not really out anything. And, I got to use and enjoy the card in the meantime.

I'm sorry I know there are issues with the game that could be discussed, and I know that if you are trying to buy/sell cards at a profit to collect TE for event use that's a different stor, but I just think people need to relax about the change in value of TE and not blame it for their lack of ability to trade.

I LIKE the fact that TE has become more valuable (making it more enticing to purchase it for the fanta coin price) and I hate to see people blame the increase in value of TE (by calling it a "market collapse") on an inability to increase your own net worth through maxing/selling cards, looking for reasonable trades (and being open to reasonable offers!), not taking rejections personally, impatience to get your dream card, feeling entitled to a specific rare card before your net worth is there yet and then getting mad when someone won't sell it to you for less than they value it for, etc etc.
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masta518
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Fri Mar 15, 2013 3:53 pm

Tattycoram wrote:
~

It seems to be that the real problem is: what happens when there's simply no TE left in the system? That's what everyone is concerned about.
Well, I guess there are those who are still mad that their cards are worth less TE, but that's just ignorance and I ignore them.
I personally don't believe the issue is TE, but what comes ~after~. Is it Luna? Is it bartering? Will the economy freeze if people refuse to migrate to a new currency? Who knows.
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Tattycoram
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Fri Mar 15, 2013 4:03 pm

masta518 wrote:
Tattycoram wrote:
~

It seems to be that the real problem is: what happens when there's simply no TE left in the system? That's what everyone is concerned about.
Well, I guess there are those who are still mad that their cards are worth less TE, but that's just ignorance and I ignore them.
I personally don't believe the issue is TE, but what comes ~after~. Is it Luna? Is it bartering? Will the economy freeze if people refuse to migrate to a new currency? Who knows.

Oh I see. Interesting question. I assumed there would always be TE because when it becomes valuable enough, some people will choose to purchase it over purchasing card packs. I would be one of those people - I would rather buy a sure thing over what I did recently - all seven step up packs and not a single solitary 5/6 Mad

Perhaps a new currency will emerge based on the new cards we are hearing rumors about (enhancement-only cards) or something similar. But regardless, as I said, card value relative to other cards stays the same, so I'm just trying to suggest that it's not something to be as worried about as some people seem to be, and that it's wrong to blame the changing value of TE on an individual's inability to trade, which might be based on other factors as listed in my post.

Thanks for the reply and letting me come into the conversation.
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SnowTempest
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Fri Mar 15, 2013 6:18 pm

prices have been falling over due to the recent step up packs and rich people buying too many packs to get Diana. the stock increases and the demand goes lower. Imagine how many 4*s we all get from the step up packs. Since there's just so many stock, people push for lower prices. I immediately traded most of my pulls from step ups to LE 5* and 6*s to escape the price collapse. So still relatively fine here.

Though I have to say, its most proftiable to just buy TE right now then pulling cards.
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Whenesday
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Sun Mar 17, 2013 2:10 pm

Some people just need to calm down and stop blaming on people instead of trying to see how they can work towards their goals instead.

Many of us did a lot of hard work (and/or money) to attain what we have currently, and of course expect the newcomers to also go through the same route to attain what they want as well.
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Happiemealz
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Sun Mar 17, 2013 9:32 pm

Sure, the shortage of TE is making the economy head south. But it heads south for EVERYTHING. When I first started 2 months ago max 4s sold at 8TE, a fresh Vlad was 250, Nana was 600.

Max 4s now sell for 4-5TE, Vlad's hovering at over 100, Nana's 350-400. Looks about right to me, it will take as long to save for a 6* now as it was back then.

I clocked 15 hr days over 1.5 months for my first 6*. Some of the more seasoned free players took 2-3 times longer than I did. The recent event with Dermond and Mata is creating a false sense of entitlement among some of the newer free players regarding the ease in acquiring high end cards.

I used to feel aggrieved about the TE shortage too, but it's a problem that won't go away with just talking.
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Nykidxxx
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Sun Mar 17, 2013 11:02 pm

Ive spent an hour plus reading through all this lol, a lot of idea and many that are interesting. Though I see no benefit in 3 pages of blame game >.>

Hi I am a new player that started during the Star Maiden event, like a month or so ago? I now have 5 5* 15 TE 15Pots 30 fresh 4* 4 lv40 4* feeders and some other crap Very Happy . I got my first 5* about a week and a half or two weeks into the game, fiona for 14te, then found out she sux and sold her for 15 te quickly lol. Wink

edit* Wanted to express how much effort I put into getting what I have! Scanned a thousand walls, advertised on hundreds, learned the approx prices of the most popular units, traded around and around, I grinded Dermond and traded him for 2 5*~ Very Happy sold off/traded dozens of maxed 4*, etc, you get my point.


TE is a very unstable source of money, imagine the real world deals only in paper money and the only way to heat a house in winter is to burn some of it for fire. The poor guys would be really hella broke right? Razz

A. One possibility is that we move from TE to luna, perhaps what Mobage hopes for since luna is the actual currency in Fanta. Hence the TE(p) hand outs only. Then TE would be a luxury affored only to pay2win players for boosts in events.
-Problems are many ofcourse, like only 10k per click in trade, max holding 10mil, useless cept for enhance, etc.

B. Full on bartering! Someone mentioned this, the "value" of the cards themselves HAVE NOT CHANGED!! My max Camille used to be 20-30TE, a Max SleipU used to be 35-45TE, now my Camille is 15-20TE and a SleipU is 30-35TE. The TE trade value might have gone down, but the cards themselves are still the same "value" relative to their popularity and demand. I sure max 4* are now 4TE, but then again Max 5* are hitting under 20TE, and Max 6* are hitting under 100TE. The game economy looks kinda normal if you toss out all mention of TE and base them on their "value" compared to other cards.


Just some thoughts ^^
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Nykidxxx
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Mon Mar 18, 2013 12:17 am

Browsed trade forum found this guy

Tanith - Max level 4TE
Zenobia - max level 3TE

T.T
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lmnseason
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Mon Mar 18, 2013 12:21 am

Nykidxxx wrote:
Browsed trade forum found this guy

Tanith - Max level 4TE
Zenobia - max level 3TE

T.T

I don't mind buying Tanith. I have 2 of them and I don't intend of selling her.
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ATB
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Mon Mar 18, 2013 11:31 am

That deal is a steal.
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Mon Mar 18, 2013 12:24 pm

I was browsing rare card reports for a good portion of the day yesterday looking for someone selling Therese. These two things I happened to see made my mind spin.

1. Someone selling Paris for 160/180TE (Forgot which price it was)

2. Someone auctioning Elizabeth and it eventually being sold for 255 TE FFS. (And even then it was only sold at that because the person buying her managed to get the price out right before the time limit was up. There was a few people who was slightly late offering up to 280 TE)

Seriously, what the hell? I knew Elizabeth was over-rated as fuck, but this is ridiculous. A Paris should NOT worth 100 TE less than Elizabeth.
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BraveDemon



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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Mon Mar 18, 2013 12:31 pm

^ Thanks for the PC on my Liz unit.

Yeah she's been slowly gaining value... while my 6* cards have been declining in value... T_T
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Nykidxxx
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Mon Mar 18, 2013 3:16 pm

I think once the high level players start to have thousands of TE and 20-50 6* cards, they really don't need 6* so they sell it for the cheapest possible, undercutting the value for lower lvl players with only a few 6*.

On the other hand, cards with extremely good art is still rare and the richest players already have them collected reducing the pool even further so that new players who have just hit the range to where they have many 6* and don't need more, but want to collect cards with good art; they would have to pay more and more.


NOTE: When I say high level, I mean either very very old players or extreme cash spenders.
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Tue Mar 19, 2013 8:42 am

Nykidxxx wrote:
Browsed trade forum found this guy

Tanith - Max level 4TE
Zenobia - max level 3TE

T.T

I'm guessing he already sold his Tanith?
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leosiu
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Wed Mar 20, 2013 12:17 am

If you guys read my replied on "a little thought on game economy" before, you will know my position about the current TE shortage/card:TE price reduction.
1. TE has its own supply and demand
2. Cards (no matter 4*/5*/6*) has their own supply and demand
3. Net flow in of cards>>>>net flow in of TE (TE is a net flow out, if you just could the free TE prize)
4. m4* or lv40 4* is not a good currency coz they are not all the same (similar value only as feeder) and at the end, there must be user, someone who use them to enhance their cards or else they are rubbish. Also, number of new good cards used by new paid players are limited and so, the demand will not be high.
5. Luna is never a good currency.
6. TE and pots are good currency.
7. You need a team, probably 5-10 of 6* instead of 1000 4*.
8. Trading benefit both parties, top players does not need 5* but TE or feeders.
9. You cannot expect SS to change, coz they are not going to, you can quit or sell your cards for USD in another site.

New Thought
1. Number of new player increase and as a rule of thumb, mostly free players, experience farming is "faster", ie, the machine of experience generator is faster, ie. cost of experience is lowered. ie, value of experience bearing cards lowered. ie your TE value of maxed 4* and lv 40 4* will be lowered!
2. 4* oversupply is too obvious nowadays, some LE will not hold the value anymore (like V. day and Maidens, probably beastmen too)
3. 5* oversupply is being clearer, we will have 5* feeders later on (like Thrain, Elena, Adoph, Emma) when their lv 80 price meet the m4* price. (btw, you can hardly sell Thrain for 10TE today and you can buy a fresh Cammille easily for 10TE. Also, think about the price of Diane, ~80 maxed but 35 maxed nowadays). It is easy to get 5* but not 6* now.
4. 6* price will hold firm (compare to the collapse of 5*) coz of the rarity and coz most people cannot efficiently obtain TE to get 6* from top/paid players. However, 6* market will almost cease as long as saved up players spent their TE for buying 6*. (more difficult for free players to to get TE)
5. 7* will not push down the price too much coz they are too rare to do that like LE 6*, which is two different market between regular or 6* with higher supply.
6. The bundle of card packs and event items is the reason why 4* and 5* oversupply.
7. The extreme low pull rate is the reason why 6* is expensive and most of the time, hold value coz their price are determined by few people.
8. You're playing a card game, not a TE collection game, however, maximum 5 item trade made the TE/pot a better currency than anything.
9. Black market (USD based) will take over the TE based market.
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masta518
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Wed Mar 20, 2013 12:25 am

leosiu wrote:
3. 5* oversupply is being clearer, we will have 5* feeders later on (like Thrain, Elena, Adoph, Emma) when their lv 80 price meet the m4* price.
9. Black market (USD based) will take over the TE based market.
These are interesting predictions. Not sure I agree about #9 tho since I doubt many people know of the black market (unless they start spreading word of mouth lols xD).

The general gist of the problem is the economy freezing though. You are right in that people cannot sell 4* reliably anymore, maxed or fresh is irrelevant. I guess we'll reach a point where everyone will have a 5* team (since higher level people want to get rid of them), but 6* seems literally impossible unless you get lucky with LE 5* or something to sweeten the deal.
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leosiu
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Wed Mar 20, 2013 12:50 am

masta518 wrote:
leosiu wrote:
3. 5* oversupply is being clearer, we will have 5* feeders later on (like Thrain, Elena, Adoph, Emma) when their lv 80 price meet the m4* price.
9. Black market (USD based) will take over the TE based market.
These are interesting predictions. Not sure I agree about #9 tho since I doubt many people know of the black market (unless they start spreading word of mouth lols xD).

The general gist of the problem is the economy freezing though. You are right in that people cannot sell 4* reliably anymore, maxed or fresh is irrelevant. I guess we'll reach a point where everyone will have a 5* team (since higher level people want to get rid of them), but 6* seems literally impossible unless you get lucky with LE 5* or something to sweeten the deal.

If you have studied the economy of collapsed economy or currency, barter or another currency will take over, black market is always an important part in economy, more important that what we think. That's why I have these prediction. Also, it is where quitting players get rid of their cards and as long as top players do not want to afford the price of card pack+TE, they will quit. Middle players cannot get 6* for long time, they will quit. They either hold their card in account, give to friends or sell to someone else for whatsoever, maybe TE though Wink .

Some people are selling lv10 4* for 1TE, but to certain point, these selling will cease coz not profitable anymore.

4* oversupply to certain point, when f4* and m4* are sold in Luna, free player's game is over. Even in the market today, you need 5x m4* to get 20-25TE, which is almost a 5* however, you cannot get the 6* by maxed 5* unless someone buy them as feeders and give you 6*. So sorry that the supply of 6* is not as much as you think and 6* will never be feeder in foreseeable future.

btw, feeders farming is not as profitable as before coz the 6* supply is low, ie, feeders demand is low, people do not need that much feeders to level up their 5*/6*. While 4* supply is high and there are a lot of free players, ie. feeders supply will be high.

No matter how you wanna to get TE, it is impossible to collect enough for 6* coz of low TE supply.

Top players only pay for feeders when needed, but not necessary in TE. They would rather pay in 5* and you guys will accept them.

You can sell them to new players but they don't have enough TE to pay for it. So, you will have to break them down into smaller pieces, like TE+m4*+lv40 4*+......So, the transaction cost is increased. (barter is high transaction cost work)
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Wed Mar 20, 2013 7:46 am

leosiu wrote:

6. TE and pots are good currency.

4. 6* price will hold firm (compare to the collapse of 5*) coz of the rarity and coz most people cannot efficiently obtain TE to get 6* from top/paid players. However, 6* market will almost cease as long as saved up players spent their TE for buying 6*. (more difficult for free players to to get TE)

TE and Pots are terrible currency :/ The reason the market is crashing is because of the terrible currency we are using. Any ingame economy or even real world economy would collapse if the main currency they use is also burned up for entertainment. the TE flows into 6* holders then into events, and nothing comes back. Mobage should count the number of TE used for an event and hand back that number as prizes evenly through all players in the next event, therefore keeping balance in te inflow and outflow.


I saw a Paris trying to sell for 170 for three days on my wall, and a monica going for 160, both maxed. I am only a month old in this game, but I do believe these cards are worth 300+?
6* cards have a range too you know, 100-2500, it becomes the same as 5* and 6*, the 2500 might hold firm since theres only like 50-200 of that card total, but the rest would have to compete and sell for cheaper in order to amass the TE needed for the 2500 cards.


So tl;dr version
1. Top rank event players need TE to use in events
2. Only sell Top LE 6* at top prices.
3. Regular 6* owners compete to sell their reg 6* for cheaper while hoarding TE
4. Reg 6* owners only want TE or to up-trade.
5. 5* owners cannot trade-up now, must need TE.
6. 4* players must trade TE to buy 5*
7. 4* players get TE(p) from events.
8. Wheres the TE?
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PostSubject: Re: Prices making you head hurt? Come and tell us your sad story!   Today at 7:52 pm

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